Pre-Sales Concerns

[philulrich]

Hello,

I've been using your application on a trial basis for a few days, but I have concerns prior to buying that maybe you can help ease. I'll itemize them below:

-- iOS application
---- The current version doesn't even understand what a retina display is. It was updated in October of last year? Do your developers not understand how iOS applications are made? Retina friendly apps have been around for a long time. I would have expected this to be included already.
---- The current version does not support very long passwords. I had previously set my password to be ~64 characters, but while this worked for logging in to the web app; the mobile application would not work. Returning that the password is invalid. Why this is the case alludes me, but my suspicion is that it's because this application is just poorly coded.
-- Support
---- I find the current options for support odd and rather lacking. For a company of your caliber, I would expect some type of ticketing system. Instead I see an option to go to a form or a button for "paying customers" that opens up the mail client on my computer. Let's put aside that this wording is condescending and makes me feel as if I, as a pre-sales customer, do not feel as if I can get real support... this is jr league stuff. Email is not a good way to offer support as the primary means of communication.
---- I have easily been able to find many many posts of this forum that have had no staff reply. Some even with no reply at all. It seems like only some questions and concerns get addressed and others just get left behind. Even if it is really delayed or the same as a reply to another post, some reply is better than none at all. Even if it's just "We still have no ready plans for an apple watch app", that's a great response compared to none at all.
-- General Usability Issues
---- I cannot get IFTTT to integrate. It takes me to a login screen that asks for a username and password. I have no username for my sighthound proper account (licensing). My sighthound forum account has a username, but that login didn't work. My local "remote access" has a username, but that doesn't work. Trying my licensing email and password, doesn't work. Trying my email and an API key doesn't work. With potentially four sets of logins, it might be good to specify which I should use. Either way, none of them are working.
---- I cannot get my mac app to open at all. This isn't a huge deal for me currently, because I have this running on my windows server. I find that the application will not open concerning though. Just sits at "Just a moment..." for a minute then fails with an error saying to "wait a minute and try again". What does that even mean? I've tried removing/installing. Same issue.
-- Licensing Concerns
---- With two options for licensing 2 or ∞; I don't have much option other than choose "pro". I hardly consider my garage cam, kitchen cam, and bedroom cam "pro" though. Forbid I even have a porch cam. That's 4. It's hard to think of many normal consumer applications that only have 2 cameras.
---- Renewing... while I recognize that it takes money to keep up innovation, my "pro" application of this license will cost me $50 additional dollars each year. This gets me (seemingly limited) updates and support via an email from a button that opens my local email client (which I might or might not actually have set up or use). I have to keep renewing though if I want any updates though (aside from bugfixes) and if I don't I either end up paying the renewal fees I would have had to pay or pay for a new license.

I mean, as much negative there is to say, there is a lot of positive. Such as this being one of the best applications I have found of it's kind as of yet for consumer applications. I'm just having a hard time convincing myself that the pros outweigh the significant issues I have with the rest of this.. Can you help me work through these issues so that I can feel justified in buying a license?

Thanks

- Phil

[coastdweller]

I've decided not to renew when the time comes. I've done testing and attempted to put various parts of the system into a ramdisk and no matter what it's unusable. Moving on.

[philulrich]

I've decided not to renew when the time comes. I've done testing and attempted to put various parts of the system into a ramdisk and no matter what it's unusable. Moving on.

At first I was a little confused with what you said, but I read through your post history and understand. Thanks for the valuable input.

[ryan]

iOS:

I've filed a bug to ensure the max password length in iOS matches that of the desktop app.

Support:

It's great that you'd want a ticketing system, but we've found that most users prefer email rather than needing to go check for updates at a separate location to interact. We certainly have a ticketing system on our side, as you would be able to see if you wrote to us.

As a trial user you're entitled to full support.

The forums are meant to be a place where the community can interact. I can understand that you might want someone to reply to every post, but I'm not sure adding a "we read this" message to every feature request provides anything of value if there is nothing of substance to add. We do read all posts that are written.

General:

IFTTT - The account and password would be for your Sighthound account that you used to log in to download the app and that you also entered into the desktop application after installing. More info about IFTTT connection can be found at https://www.sighthound.com/support/send-ifttt-trigger

Mac App - What version of macOS are you running? A minimum of 10.8 is required. If possible please zip and send us the /Library/Application Support/Sighthound Video/Logs directory and we'll see what might be going on.

Licensing:

Options - We don't have any immediate plans to change our licensing structure but we'll certainly take yours and all other feedback into consideration in the future. I can't share numbers but I think you'd be very surprised at the number of 2 camera setups.

Renewing - You never have to renew if you don't want to. A license comes with 1 year of support and upgrades. You're entitled to forever run any major version of the application (4.0, 5.0) that was released while your subscription was active, and any minor versions released any time, even after your subscription has expired (5.1, 5.2, 5.3,...).

"I don't I either end up paying the renewal fees I would have had to pay or pay for a new license" - You never have to pay a full license price to return to the latest version, unless your subscription had lapsed for 5 years. If you don't renew and 2 years later a major version is released you wanted, you'd simply need to pay for the 2 years of missed. Unlike normal upgrade offers for software that only allow moving from the previous version to the current and have a limited offer window, you can always upgrade from any version to the latest at a discounted price.

Hope that helps,
- ryan

[philulrich]

iOS:
- So is the lack of reply in regards to the retina display an acknowledgement that this won't be fixed? Just comparing this app to an open source app easily shows the difference it makes:
Open Source File transfer app:


Sighthound:


This alone is a bit of a deal breaker for me. Apps that aren't updated to take advantage of the screen real estate hurt my eyes.
- Thanks for filing that bug for the password.

Support:
- Well I guess it's good to know that there is a ticket system somewhere. It might be worthwhile keeping in mind that not everyone uses an email program on their computer or even the email program their system will open up. This is mostly an antiquated method of initiating contact for quite a few reasons. This is just a couple old links I found from a quick google that touches on it:
--- https://blog.seibert-media.com/2014/10/ ... -websites/
--- https://www.campaignmonitor.com/blog/em ... tml-email/

- You might think that not every post needs a reply and yes, this is for the community to interact. Ultimately how y'all handle that is up to you. For people analyzing support and company viability though, things such as that are concerning. Especially if staff are replying to most of the posts here.

General:
- For IFFFT I still can't get my licensing portal email and password to work.
- I'm running macos sierra. I'll provide that log via email later today likely.

Licensing:
- I still stand by what I said, but I understand that it's your business model that licensing is the way that it is. I appreciate that you are hearing feedback and I personally hope it might be modified at some point. Even if it's just "add-on" packs for additional cameras. The gap between 2 and infiniti is really large.


In general, I'm glad to see that you took this tough feedback head on instead of deleting this post or ignoring that. That is something I can respect.

Thanks for your time, Ryan.

- Phil

[ryan]

I didn't respond to the retina comment because it seemed mostly inflammatory comments about our developers and I wasn't sure what to address there vs. all the other concrete points.

The app is retina aware. Based on the screenshot you've uploaded my guess is that your comment isn't actually about retina but rather you'd prefer more of the screen were dedicated to camera images vs. text and/or that the size/quality of images retrieved for clip thumbnails was increased. Or you'd prefer them to be smaller to fit more on the screen as the images in your screenshot - this was a conscious size choice as anything of smaller dimensions makes it difficult for many to see any detail within the thumbnail itself, but possibly something that could be offered as an alternate layout.

We're currently in the midst of a remote access overhaul but it's impact on the mobile app specifically is related to speed of connections as well as quality of live streams rather than layouts. UI changes for the mobile app is something that may follow in future updates.

All feedback is valuable feedback, and we're not into censorship. I don't think we've never deleted a post other than those added by spam bots or spam accounts. There may have been one for extreme vulgarity that couldn't be saved by some simple editing, but I don't actually recall.

Unfortunately, regardless of how passionate or desirable a given feature request may be, we can't implement each one as quickly as everyone would like, or ultimately at all - even given unlimited resources everyone wants a slightly different application and not all of those visions can sensibly coexist. We'll keep working to make the best app we can but we recognize it won't necessarily be a fit for all scenarios. If Sighthound Video isn't the right app for someone at any given moment we will always wish them the best in finding a solution that fits their needs and see what we might be able to make to win them over down the road.

[philulrich]

Well the app might be retina aware, but if that's the case then you likely aren't developing it native, but rather using some type of multi-platform tool that compiles the app weirdly. That is definitely using the 2x mode of non-retina apps. You cannot see it in that picture, but you can in this one:



A clear indicator that an app is not retina ready is visible by the iOS compensating for it by doubling the size of everything thus making everything look pixelated. I'm critical of this because anyone who doesn't address an eyesore like this needs some real hard critical feedback.

Ultimately you can do what you want with this feedback. I'm taking the time to give some solid information that, believe it or not, many other people are going to be taking note of and using as a deciding factor in what software they use. The odds of much coming from this feedback is not in my favor and I knew that coming in. But maybe you aren't aware of the stuff I'm pointing out. I didn't see any related topics so I figured I'd at least point them out.

- Phil

[Yegor]

Apple fanboys always get so hot under the collar when things don't work exactly how they expect.

The meltdown over at the Fingbox group is similar over the last few days when it was realized that iOS11 blocks MAC Address pulls from APPS. My response is always the same.. Use Windows and Android. Not Apple. Apple was cool in the 1980's. Not today.

[jiriteach]

Your point around licensing was a no go for me. I successfully trialled the product and I think it’s great - does need work as it’s aging badly but it’s functional and does the basics well.

I have 4 cameras but need detailed detection for 2 and basic/no detection but want this presented through the same app! I just don’t understand the licensing model - no ability to scale. I would happily purchase 2 x $60 but that’s not possible.

I asked for a deal and was told they would rather loose the business of 2 x $60 and cannot offer a deal.

This is disappointing. The lack of updates is also a concern to pay the Pro price.

The standard line - we’ll reviewing licensing has been in review for over 2 years. Such a shame overall as so much missed business.

Who has just 2 cameras nowadays?

[Cristiano]

I suggest you to try Axxon Next, a very advanced software which is free up to 4 cameras, I posted a pre sale request here but no answer, this made me search for other options and found Axxon Next which is used widely in Europe. It is a professional software, with advanced deep learning and hardware accelleration.
cheers